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	<title>Comments on: Rugby trumps politics and racial divisions in South Africa as quota system is dropped</title>
	<link>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/</link>
	<description>Straightforward rugby commentary from a North American perspective</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jul 2008 23:49:13 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2.1</generator>

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		<title>By: Garth</title>
		<link>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-4566</link>
		<author>Garth</author>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 14:18:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-4566</guid>
		<description>It’s really quite simple. What has the quota system delivered? Nothing really, or not much that can be measured anyway. Why persist with something that clearly isn’t working? 
You get radical and take passports away from players for example and you risk disillusioning the entire South African public. You think the youngsters want to get involved with a sport when it has a bad name. No, they want to be their heroes; they want to be world champions. 
What’s more is that Rugby in this country has been a secular religion. The domain of the Afrikaans mercenaries. Yes, other races were not really allowed to play the game but there have been examples of players of other races playing for SA even in its apartheid days. 
Today, rugby in SA is quite different. Everyone is allowed to play the game. We have seen black and coloured players being selected on merit at Super 14 level for some time now. This is the toughest rugby competition in the world. To make it here you have to be world class. You simply can’t expect people that can’t make it at this level to play at this level. You send those poor lads out there and it will be another example of lambs to the slaughter. 
What this country needs is unity more now than ever. Sport is an awesome vehicle to achieve this. Let not *&#38;ck it up now yeah. Develop the players when they are young and you will get your players of colour. Play a team with a radical no of black players now and not only will the team not be united but the poor black players that will have to play top level rugby will simply get hurt and embarrassed possibly even ending careers prematurely. Anyone that knows and has played the game at any reasonable level knows this to be true. 
It’s going to take time yes but its time people realised that today’s players are not selected because they are white. Players are selected on merit. Apartheid was a huge mistake but why punish the game for the mistakes of regime.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It’s really quite simple. What has the quota system delivered? Nothing really, or not much that can be measured anyway. Why persist with something that clearly isn’t working?<br />
You get radical and take passports away from players for example and you risk disillusioning the entire South African public. You think the youngsters want to get involved with a sport when it has a bad name. No, they want to be their heroes; they want to be world champions.<br />
What’s more is that Rugby in this country has been a secular religion. The domain of the Afrikaans mercenaries. Yes, other races were not really allowed to play the game but there have been examples of players of other races playing for SA even in its apartheid days.<br />
Today, rugby in SA is quite different. Everyone is allowed to play the game. We have seen black and coloured players being selected on merit at Super 14 level for some time now. This is the toughest rugby competition in the world. To make it here you have to be world class. You simply can’t expect people that can’t make it at this level to play at this level. You send those poor lads out there and it will be another example of lambs to the slaughter.<br />
What this country needs is unity more now than ever. Sport is an awesome vehicle to achieve this. Let not *&amp;ck it up now yeah. Develop the players when they are young and you will get your players of colour. Play a team with a radical no of black players now and not only will the team not be united but the poor black players that will have to play top level rugby will simply get hurt and embarrassed possibly even ending careers prematurely. Anyone that knows and has played the game at any reasonable level knows this to be true.<br />
It’s going to take time yes but its time people realised that today’s players are not selected because they are white. Players are selected on merit. Apartheid was a huge mistake but why punish the game for the mistakes of regime.</p>
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		<title>By: Vic</title>
		<link>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-919</link>
		<author>Vic</author>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Nov 2007 03:29:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-919</guid>
		<description>Bad speelers of the world...UNTIE!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bad speelers of the world&#8230;UNTIE!</p>
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		<title>By: Josh Houston</title>
		<link>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-918</link>
		<author>Josh Houston</author>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Nov 2007 02:45:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-918</guid>
		<description>Pig picture? Eh?

If you're talking about broadening it to all sports and even societal and economic issues, I'm all for it. It's a good plan and you've got my vote senator.

Still I'm not interested in seeing any movies about pigs......</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pig picture? Eh?</p>
<p>If you&#8217;re talking about broadening it to all sports and even societal and economic issues, I&#8217;m all for it. It&#8217;s a good plan and you&#8217;ve got my vote senator.</p>
<p>Still I&#8217;m not interested in seeing any movies about pigs&#8230;&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Vic</title>
		<link>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-895</link>
		<author>Vic</author>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Nov 2007 16:12:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-895</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;@Josh: I know my idea sounds excessive, but we are not actually talking about rugby. We are talking about changing the culture of a nation. It's tough, and a long term, &lt;s&gt;pig&lt;/s&gt; big picture solution is necessary. I would say my plan was not broad enough is its scope. Expand it to all sports. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;@Rich: Mad Respect. Keep up the good work.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Josh: I know my idea sounds excessive, but we are not actually talking about rugby. We are talking about changing the culture of a nation. It&#8217;s tough, and a long term, <s>pig</s> big picture solution is necessary. I would say my plan was not broad enough is its scope. Expand it to all sports. </p>
<p>@Rich: Mad Respect. Keep up the good work.</p>
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		<title>By: Rich</title>
		<link>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-891</link>
		<author>Rich</author>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Nov 2007 14:24:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-891</guid>
		<description>I coached high school Rugby for years in the Midwestern US. My area is extremely racially diverse. But in 10 years I only fielded two African Americans....TWO! And I tried with very active, pointed recruiting. 

I once asked one of my two black players "why don't other Blacks play?". The answer: "They thinks it's a white man's game, plus it can't lead to the big bucks of professional sports in the US like (American) Football or Basketball can".

We have big perceptional and real (financial) hurdles here in the US. And here Rugby misses out on great athletes due to these problems. I have no cure, except to keep trying.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I coached high school Rugby for years in the Midwestern US. My area is extremely racially diverse. But in 10 years I only fielded two African Americans&#8230;.TWO! And I tried with very active, pointed recruiting. </p>
<p>I once asked one of my two black players &#8220;why don&#8217;t other Blacks play?&#8221;. The answer: &#8220;They thinks it&#8217;s a white man&#8217;s game, plus it can&#8217;t lead to the big bucks of professional sports in the US like (American) Football or Basketball can&#8221;.</p>
<p>We have big perceptional and real (financial) hurdles here in the US. And here Rugby misses out on great athletes due to these problems. I have no cure, except to keep trying.</p>
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		<title>By: Joe</title>
		<link>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-858</link>
		<author>Joe</author>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Nov 2007 16:11:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-858</guid>
		<description>Quota systems are a top down method for instituting environmental change. By and large, I believe the success of such systems has been marginal if you look at the American educational system as an example. While it is imperative to eliminate artificial barriers preventing opportunity (e.g., earlier black exclusion from professional sports in the US), forcing selection based upon racial lines only gives the appearance of equality not the reality. By creating opportunity at all levels of sport and by developing all players from the earliest stages, the admittedly slow transition to a more diverse and likely more talented team will occur because of the larger pool of candidates to draw from. Obvious to most, with the elimination of some barriers there are some sports in the US that have come to be dominated by black athletes despite the fact that they represent a minority of the population. Furthermore, the increase in playing opportunities and participation have led to greater diversity all around sport including coaching, management, and ownership although this penetration is quite variable for the different professional leagues (e.g., MLB versus NBA). While obviously no where near perfect, this is an example of how opportunity and elimination of barriers can improve diversity.

Expanding this notion to South Africa, I would agree that instituting a quota system is like putting a bandaid over a much larger wound. It will not be until education and sport opportunities are expanded to everyone at all levels that real diversity will be achieved. Yes, racism will persist and, yes, inclusion will vary across and within sports (e.g., the slower introducton of black quarterbacks in the NFL), but it can improve with time using this bottom up approach. Clearly this is an imperfect approach, but there are some arguments that the institutionalization of quotas and affirmative action systems serve to increase bias and prejudice due to the perception of promotion based upon racial lines rather than ability. And this is particularly damning for those who would achieved the promotion based upon merit alone.

Switching to the US, I believe that individual economics are much less an issue than exposure. Most people don't even hear about rugby until they reach college. And despite affirmative action, proportinal enrollment for minorities lags behind other groups. While it can be argued that there are more HS programs that can reach larger groups, these tend to be clustered in a predictable fashion. The people who teach rugby are the ones who have played and, although there are exceptions, you are generally going to find more programs being developed by current or previous collegiate players in the areas that they live. So suburban HS programs will be more common than urban programs, and Milwaukee is a good example - lots of suburban HS rugby programs, none in the inner city.

So to the point of this long diatribe - Whether the SA sports minister believes his own words or is just riding the tidal wave, I agree that exposure and opportunity rather than quotas are the keys to diversifying the SA national team. This dictates that the charter should address plans for the introduction of rugby to all children in SA regardless of race. While it is a very daunting task, the overwhelming presence of soccer throughout the US and the resulting changes in national team play are examples of what can be achieved with this approach. If only US rugby could follow suit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Quota systems are a top down method for instituting environmental change. By and large, I believe the success of such systems has been marginal if you look at the American educational system as an example. While it is imperative to eliminate artificial barriers preventing opportunity (e.g., earlier black exclusion from professional sports in the US), forcing selection based upon racial lines only gives the appearance of equality not the reality. By creating opportunity at all levels of sport and by developing all players from the earliest stages, the admittedly slow transition to a more diverse and likely more talented team will occur because of the larger pool of candidates to draw from. Obvious to most, with the elimination of some barriers there are some sports in the US that have come to be dominated by black athletes despite the fact that they represent a minority of the population. Furthermore, the increase in playing opportunities and participation have led to greater diversity all around sport including coaching, management, and ownership although this penetration is quite variable for the different professional leagues (e.g., MLB versus NBA). While obviously no where near perfect, this is an example of how opportunity and elimination of barriers can improve diversity.</p>
<p>Expanding this notion to South Africa, I would agree that instituting a quota system is like putting a bandaid over a much larger wound. It will not be until education and sport opportunities are expanded to everyone at all levels that real diversity will be achieved. Yes, racism will persist and, yes, inclusion will vary across and within sports (e.g., the slower introducton of black quarterbacks in the NFL), but it can improve with time using this bottom up approach. Clearly this is an imperfect approach, but there are some arguments that the institutionalization of quotas and affirmative action systems serve to increase bias and prejudice due to the perception of promotion based upon racial lines rather than ability. And this is particularly damning for those who would achieved the promotion based upon merit alone.</p>
<p>Switching to the US, I believe that individual economics are much less an issue than exposure. Most people don&#8217;t even hear about rugby until they reach college. And despite affirmative action, proportinal enrollment for minorities lags behind other groups. While it can be argued that there are more HS programs that can reach larger groups, these tend to be clustered in a predictable fashion. The people who teach rugby are the ones who have played and, although there are exceptions, you are generally going to find more programs being developed by current or previous collegiate players in the areas that they live. So suburban HS programs will be more common than urban programs, and Milwaukee is a good example - lots of suburban HS rugby programs, none in the inner city.</p>
<p>So to the point of this long diatribe - Whether the SA sports minister believes his own words or is just riding the tidal wave, I agree that exposure and opportunity rather than quotas are the keys to diversifying the SA national team. This dictates that the charter should address plans for the introduction of rugby to all children in SA regardless of race. While it is a very daunting task, the overwhelming presence of soccer throughout the US and the resulting changes in national team play are examples of what can be achieved with this approach. If only US rugby could follow suit.</p>
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		<title>By: Josh Houston</title>
		<link>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-833</link>
		<author>Josh Houston</author>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Nov 2007 00:50:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-833</guid>
		<description>@Wouter: How you doing buddy? I'm not against a team being made up of the best players, but can you leave it up to South Africa to select their team made up of the best players? Affirmative action and quotas may be a bit excessive, but I don't know if there's another solution. I remember you saying that quotas hurt your team and that you'd be much better without them. But imagine if South Africa DID develop youth rugby equally among whites and blacks. After all didn't Habana just win another award, South Africa's player of the year?

@Vic: I like your plan. I would like to see it implemented here in job hiring and other racially affected venues. But are we being realistic? We're talking about rugby here not social issues or work related issues. Your plan seems a bit excessive for s sport. I realize South African's take their rugby seriously, but this might be a bit much. The things you outline in your plan require money, time and effort. I'm not sure these things could be warranted in terms of rugby. Besides, keeping records and tracking statistics will most likely be monitored the wrong people anyway. A politician changing his stance on the quota system is hardly anything to be up in arms about. He's a politician, they change their minds all of the time depending on the current political climate.

The reason they had a quota system and the reason we have affirmative action is because we and they were unable to choose based on merit. We basically opened the doors and welcomed in these things when we decided choosing people based on race was more relevant than choosing on merit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Wouter: How you doing buddy? I&#8217;m not against a team being made up of the best players, but can you leave it up to South Africa to select their team made up of the best players? Affirmative action and quotas may be a bit excessive, but I don&#8217;t know if there&#8217;s another solution. I remember you saying that quotas hurt your team and that you&#8217;d be much better without them. But imagine if South Africa DID develop youth rugby equally among whites and blacks. After all didn&#8217;t Habana just win another award, South Africa&#8217;s player of the year?</p>
<p>@Vic: I like your plan. I would like to see it implemented here in job hiring and other racially affected venues. But are we being realistic? We&#8217;re talking about rugby here not social issues or work related issues. Your plan seems a bit excessive for s sport. I realize South African&#8217;s take their rugby seriously, but this might be a bit much. The things you outline in your plan require money, time and effort. I&#8217;m not sure these things could be warranted in terms of rugby. Besides, keeping records and tracking statistics will most likely be monitored the wrong people anyway. A politician changing his stance on the quota system is hardly anything to be up in arms about. He&#8217;s a politician, they change their minds all of the time depending on the current political climate.</p>
<p>The reason they had a quota system and the reason we have affirmative action is because we and they were unable to choose based on merit. We basically opened the doors and welcomed in these things when we decided choosing people based on race was more relevant than choosing on merit.</p>
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		<title>By: Vic</title>
		<link>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-832</link>
		<author>Vic</author>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Nov 2007 00:18:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-832</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;@BigDave: If I can generalize to America from your 'Milwaukee' comments, I agree that the black and Hispanic  communities are not emphasized as potential sources for new players. Why is that? Although there are dues in rugby, many clubs waive these dues in the first year. Thus, the only thing someone needs is a $40 pair of cleats and $20 for shorts/socks. I think $60 is probably the lowest cost of entry of any sport in America with the  possible exception of table tennis. :)
&lt;p&gt;@wouter: I agree, quotas are not the answer, but neither is changing your political flavor on the public tide like Minister Stofile who long endorsed the quota system. Frankly, I don't believe he ever felt that the quota system was 'window dressing'. Rather, he is riding the wave of popularity that has accompanied the Webb Ellis Cup.
&lt;p&gt;My point in this article is that there has not been accountability or preparation for a long term solution to the under-representation of non-whites in sport (rugby in particular).&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The Transformation Charter was a good albeit much belated step in the right direction, though a little short sighted as it was set to expire in 2014. In my opinion, this would have been a more appropriate time for a mid-term audit than 2008 as I mentioned above.
&lt;p&gt;I would like to see a 25-year plan with benchmarks, audit schedules, guaranteed funding, and a very specific budget to detail how all the young citizens of South Africa would have the opportunity to play the sport. A series of junior academies (U23, U19, U17, U15 etc...) to identify, develop and funnel the exception young athletes to the national team would be a good start.
&lt;p&gt;In short, remove the politics. Choose the team on merit, and provide an infrastructure with checks and balances to ensure change.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@BigDave: If I can generalize to America from your &#8216;Milwaukee&#8217; comments, I agree that the black and Hispanic  communities are not emphasized as potential sources for new players. Why is that? Although there are dues in rugby, many clubs waive these dues in the first year. Thus, the only thing someone needs is a $40 pair of cleats and $20 for shorts/socks. I think $60 is probably the lowest cost of entry of any sport in America with the  possible exception of table tennis. <img src='http://www.whatisrugby.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />
</p>
<p>@wouter: I agree, quotas are not the answer, but neither is changing your political flavor on the public tide like Minister Stofile who long endorsed the quota system. Frankly, I don&#8217;t believe he ever felt that the quota system was &#8216;window dressing&#8217;. Rather, he is riding the wave of popularity that has accompanied the Webb Ellis Cup.
</p>
<p>My point in this article is that there has not been accountability or preparation for a long term solution to the under-representation of non-whites in sport (rugby in particular).
</p>
<p>The Transformation Charter was a good albeit much belated step in the right direction, though a little short sighted as it was set to expire in 2014. In my opinion, this would have been a more appropriate time for a mid-term audit than 2008 as I mentioned above.
</p>
<p>I would like to see a 25-year plan with benchmarks, audit schedules, guaranteed funding, and a very specific budget to detail how all the young citizens of South Africa would have the opportunity to play the sport. A series of junior academies (U23, U19, U17, U15 etc&#8230;) to identify, develop and funnel the exception young athletes to the national team would be a good start.
</p>
<p>In short, remove the politics. Choose the team on merit, and provide an infrastructure with checks and balances to ensure change.</p>
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		<title>By: wouter</title>
		<link>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-831</link>
		<author>wouter</author>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Nov 2007 22:53:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-831</guid>
		<description>hey guys
i can tell you one thing! if you take this politic rubbish out of the sports and forget about this "quota" non-sense in south-africa, we might take that cup every time... (but on the other hand, we must give the eagles also a chance at victory!  :-)) why are people so against the best players to fill the team?? 
i can garuntee you that if affirmative action should be followed, south-africa will never even qualify to play in any world cup again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>hey guys<br />
i can tell you one thing! if you take this politic rubbish out of the sports and forget about this &#8220;quota&#8221; non-sense in south-africa, we might take that cup every time&#8230; (but on the other hand, we must give the eagles also a chance at victory!  :-)) why are people so against the best players to fill the team??<br />
i can garuntee you that if affirmative action should be followed, south-africa will never even qualify to play in any world cup again.</p>
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		<title>By: Josh Houston</title>
		<link>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-830</link>
		<author>Josh Houston</author>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Nov 2007 22:06:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.whatisrugby.com/2007/11/07/rugby-trumps-politics-and-racial-divisions-in-south-africa-as-quota-system-is-dropped/#comment-830</guid>
		<description>Leave it to you to bring politics in...

Just kidding, very good piece. I love the idea of course of a nation building rugby from within the citizenry, but like you said when has it happened and will it. 

While in theory I'm against affirmative action in our country and quotas in any other when it comes to rugby, I'm for it in practice because I realize most of us are too ignorant and biased for certain decisions to be left up to the public.

In the case of South Africa, I think the quotas are necessary.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Leave it to you to bring politics in&#8230;</p>
<p>Just kidding, very good piece. I love the idea of course of a nation building rugby from within the citizenry, but like you said when has it happened and will it. </p>
<p>While in theory I&#8217;m against affirmative action in our country and quotas in any other when it comes to rugby, I&#8217;m for it in practice because I realize most of us are too ignorant and biased for certain decisions to be left up to the public.</p>
<p>In the case of South Africa, I think the quotas are necessary.</p>
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